Home Forums Mindless Banter Post any non admissions related material here How do you guys feel about Affirmative Action?

This topic contains 27 replies, has 24 voices, and was last updated by  bryaniam 7 years, 3 months ago.

Viewing 15 posts - 1 through 15 (of 28 total)
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  • #23196

    Sean Hannity
    Participant

    Hey, I’m new here, and I just wanted to get some perspectives from other people in school and at work, whatever your situation. The divisive subject is affirmative action. Personally, I think it’s a good idea, especially if it helps minorities get into school. What do you think?

    #31156

    zellino
    Participant

    Well “Sean Hannity” I think affirmative action sucks.

    What ever happened to equality of opportunity?

    And what do you say to Asians? Are we not minorities too? Affirmative action hurts me and my family.

    #31213

    iceman
    Participant

    I strongly recommend “Why Race Matters” by Michael Levin.

    EOM

    #31552

    Trademark
    Participant

    A little late…but I’m new to the site.
    Here’s a quote from Martin Luther King Jr.

    “Whenever this issue [compensatory treatment] is raised, some of our friends recoil in horror. The Negro should be granted equality, they agree, but should ask for nothing more. On the surface, this appears reasonable, but is not realistic. For it is obvious that if a man enters the starting line of a race three hundred years after another man, the second would have to perform some incredible feat in order to catch up.”
    “A society that has done something special against the Negro for hundreds of years must now do something special for him, to equip him to compete on a just and equal basis.”
    “… for 15 centuries the Negro was enslaved and robbed of any wages — potential accrued wealth which would have been the legacy of his descendants. All of America’s wealth today could not adequately compensate its Negroes for his centuries of exploitation and humiliation. It is an economic fact that a program such as I propose would certainly cost far less than any computation of two centuries of unpaid wages plus accumulated interest. In any case, I do not intend that this program of economic aid should apply only to the Negro: it should benefit the disadvantaged of all races.”

    #31647

    harvardhopeful
    Participant

    quote:


    Originally posted by Trademark

    Here’s a quote from Martin Luther King Jr.


    It seems perverse that as people support affirmative action, they ignore the deleterious effects that any decision based on skin colour takes.

    I shudder at the thought of a doctor operating on me who had been chosen based on skin colour alone.

    Discaimer: I am British. My skin-colour and my creed are irrelevant.

    #31840

    princetongrad
    Participant

    The quote you chose is interesting. However you must consider that hundreds of people are denied jobs every year because of their skin color/sex. For 300 years minorities, which happens to include women, were denied access to a book. It was literally illegal for them to read or be taught to read. Minorities were denied the basic rights and privileges that those of us in the majority see as neccessities of life.
    If sexual bias and racism did not exist your point would be well taken, but it does exist. No, what you look like should not matter, but it does matter. You know it and so do I.
    This is not, and never will be, a perfect world. Checks and balances must be put in place so those who are not in power, those who are not in the majority, will not be abused and taken advantage of again.
    If not,then we become like Kane and Abel “…am I my brothers keeper?”-The HOLY BIBLE
    We are after all, brothers and sisters, brought into this world by the one creator.
    God forbid “our” history should ever repeat itself.

    quote:


    Originally posted by harvardhopeful

    quote:


    Originally posted by Trademark

    Here’s a quote from Martin Luther King Jr.


    It seems perverse that as people support affirmative action, they ignore the deleterious effects that any decision based on skin colour takes.

    I shudder at the thought of a doctor operating on me who had been chosen based on skin colour alone.

    Discaimer: I am British. My skin-colour and my creed are irrelevant.


    #32044

    After Brown vs Board of education it was declared segration in schools was illegal. However colleges would still refuse to accept people of color. Thus afirmitive action was born. It irritates me to hear people say I don’t want a doctor who got in college from affirmitve action. No matter how you got in school the fact is that you persrvered and completed school, and validates yor A’s and degree as much as anyone elses. At the same time afimitive action cripples peoples of color. It constantly reminds them of the past that they are crippled from slavery and racsim this gives them an insecure mentality which is embeed in there unconscious mind. It sends out the message that that minorities can’t move forward, need an exta help,and dwell on the past. None of this is true! I myself being a Black minority reconizes the importance of diversity but at the same time feels it is more important to stand on my own two feet. So afirmitive action was once needed but if enforced would cripple the black community.

    #32464

    Casey Lynch
    Participant

    Affirmtive action is one of the most rediculous ideas we have ever had in this country. Why, just because im a white middle class male should i put put at a disadvantage? sure there has been racism in the past, but why should we now turn to new racism and descriminate against those of the same race as the ex-descriminators. Currently i live in Europe, in Valencia Spain, when i discuss and explain the concept of affirmitive action to my friends here, including Germans, Dutch, Slovakian, and Spanish students, they easily get confused, they cannot even grasp the idea at first. Affirmitive Action is nothing but Reverse Racism

    #33139

    noogles
    Participant

    Casey, maybe your European friends can’t understand your explanation because you’re unable to explain it to them coherently or from an unbiased perspective.

    Perhaps if you said that there were persons who, for 400 years, were raped, systematically discriminated against and, if these persons picked up a book, were at times even threatened with death, your friends might understand that universities and the US government were trying to make up for past injustices through normative policies. State and federal government in the US turned a blind eye to the intimidation and illegal treatment that black people experienced, pre-1970. The best US universities denied admission to qualified black applicants for years. Even the best and the brightest blacks could not win jobs commensurate with their talents (look up Dr. Charles Drew and see if he was ever able to teach at a top-notch medical school like Harvard’s).

    In the aftermath of our government’s “blind-eyeism”, a culture that accepted failure ensued within the black community. This coping mechanism evolved in order to dull the pain caused by the futility of being an ambitious black person in a prejudiced white society. An anti-culture formed, and blacks decided that shooting for success was tantamount to “acting white”. It’s a shame, but black students who are academically gifted must choose between books or alienation by the vast majority their black peers. Whites and Asians don’t face the same cultural dilemma, at least not of the same magnitude, that blacks do. Because government and policy and university admissions had a direct hand in creating this problem, the government and universities of today are doing what any responsible entity would do – they are accepting accountability for their transgressions, and thus are trying to ameliorate the problem to which they contributed.

    An analogy: if the government dumped toxic waste in your back yard and each successive generation of your family died of toxin-induced cancer, wouldn’t you ask for help beyond a simple toxic waste clean-up? Indeed, you would ask for considerable reparations that went beyond the clean-up of the toxins, reparations that addressed the illness caused by the waste. This is what the government is trying to do when it comes to affirmative action. A responsible government pays its debts. The policy of affirmative action is not trying to hurt you, personally. Affirmative action is not perfect in practice, but it does not deserve the assinine and poorly-reasoned rants of “reverse racism” coming from semi-literate bigots. My guess is you are merely echoing the rants of your parents, and for this i forgive you.

    FYI: Nearly every first world country practices some form of affirmative action, and even some developing nations utilize affirmative action programs. Even China has affirmative action programs that give leniency to individuals from impoverished provinces.

    #33516

    TaxMan
    Participant

    Affirmative Action (AA) is like welfare – both are wrong.

    For all who advocate AA, please answer the following: Is discrimination acceptable?
    If you answered yes, then ok, we know how you think. If you answered no… how do you justify AA and in the same breath say that discrimination is unjust?

    AA is simply discriminating against a different group of people because of their race, skin color or gender. I understand why some well-intentioned people support AA yet I think they are looking at the issue with blinders on. Is it ok to discriminate against white males simply because they are “white men?” All AA does is turn perceived discrimination against one group and applies definite discrimination against “white men.”

    When the government gets involved and imposes admission and selection criteria in the workplace and academia bad things happen and the possibility for a less talented pool results. If your goal is to study law, medicine, business or engineering at a Tier I institution then study, study, study! We should be admitted based on the merits of our qualifications, not on the basis of our skin color.

    I propose college admissions applications remove the race and gender question. The ONLY criteria that should matter for admissions are:
    (1) Test Scores
    (2) Letters of Recommendation
    (3) Extra-curricular involvement (sports, volunteerism, etc.)

    I am not racist or hateful. I am analytical and thurough. Do not confuse what you want with what is right – they do not always line up.

    I am always willing to consider other viewpoints, but let’s keep the posts facts based and not personal attacks.

    TaxMan

    #33527

    bertrandt
    Participant

    I agree wtih Taxman.

    If anything, perhaps the blacks don’t feel like they have to study as hard b/c of AA. So the Asians have to study and work even harder.

    Equality of opportuntiy is not equality of results. That is pedicated by work ethic.

    I have heard of that book by Levin. Its supposed to be based on cold hard facts. Will I be outcast like the biology nobel though if I agree with it[?]

    #33896

    rhollins
    Participant

    Oh my goodness, some of the statements on here regarding affirmative action are utterly ridiculous. First of all, Bertrandt, Asians ARE considered minorities in this country. Therefore, AA applies to them as well. In addition, AA was not put in place so that those who benefit from it do not have to study as hard. Quite the contrary, AA was put into place to allow those who HAVE studied hard and made the grades to have the same opportunity to get into the school of their choice. AA could still work for whites if they choose to attend a majority black school. AA is meant to help those who have been systematically discriminated against throughout history, and for those who are of the majority who claim reverse discrimination, that’s a bunch of bull, as you have more opportunities than minorities have had in the past, and if you don’t take advantage of those then you have no one to blame but yourself.

    #33897

    rhollins
    Participant

    Oh my goodness, some of the statements on here regarding affirmative action are utterly ridiculous. First of all, Bertrandt, Asians ARE considered minorities in this country. Therefore, AA applies to them as well. In addition, AA was not put in place so that those who benefit from it do not have to study as hard. Quite the contrary, AA was put into place to allow those who HAVE studied hard and made the grades to have the same opportunity to get into the school of their choice. AA could still work for whites if they choose to attend a majority black school. AA is meant to help those who have been systematically discriminated against throughout history, and for those who are of the majority who claim reverse discrimination, that’s a bunch of bull, as you have more opportunities than minorities have had in the past, and if you don’t take advantage of those then you have no one to blame but yourself.

    #33898

    rhollins
    Participant

    quote:


    Originally posted by TaxMan

    Affirmative Action (AA) is like welfare – both are wrong.

    I propose college admissions applications remove the race and gender question. The ONLY criteria that should matter for admissions are:
    (1) Test Scores
    (2) Letters of Recommendation
    (3) Extra-curricular involvement (sports, volunteerism, etc.)

    TaxMan


    Well, TaxMan, that is all well and good if you overlook the fact that many minority students had the test scores, letters of recommendation, and the extra-curricular involvement and still were denied an education due to their skin color. If racisim did not still exist in this country, that would be fine, but it does. I personally know of a person of African descent who applied for a job using her name, which is more common among blacks, on her resume. She did not get any calls for an interview. Using the suggestion of another, she used the same resume and used her middle name, which is more common among whites, and received several calls. Tell me that was not discrimination!

    #30926

    youngblackwoman
    Participant

    What I think many of you are missing is the fact that we are all one nation and our minorities (specifically the black and hispanic minorities) are overrepresented in poverty. And contrary to popular belief, they are not poor because they are lazy. They are poor becuase they lack education, motivation, and the means of which to obtain those things. Not only are they distracted by the nonsensical words of rappers everyday and the violence that plagues their communities, but they are in a mind set that prevents them from becoming productive members of our society as a whole. We are only as strong as our weakest link. Why should anyone question Affirmative action when it is helping make successful productive people out of those who are statistically more likely to become prison inmates then bussinessmen. I am a Junior at Florida State University and I walk passed a statue everyday that says that this scool was not integrated until 1964. My mother could not have walked on this campus because she was black. My grandmother could never have attended this University even though she was validictorian of her high school class. We forget that these things didn’t happen that long ago. There are many people still alive who could not enjoy the freedoms that we take for granted. We have a lot of making up to do to those who have suffered under the cruel hand of discrimination. And for you middle class white boys who don’t get into a school after applying one year. Think of how you would feel if you knew you could never get in. I don’t feel that Afirmative action is the best solution but so far no one has come up with a better one. I know that I can’t. We should be equally represented in every aspect of society. And as far as the Asians….. They’ll be fine. As far as I’m concerned they’re all hard working geniuses. It’s those who don’t think that they can amount to anything that we as a nation have to look out for. Because we will create our own undoing if we don’t.

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